Comments on: Shame

By: your1stopspot.com » Further Adventures In Torture Equivalencies

your1stopspot.com » Further Adventures In Torture Equivalencies — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 20:53:41 +0000

[...] this point, I think it’s worthwhile to consider the thoughtful way libertarian blogger Julian Sanchez responded to the news that these were among the interrogation tactics being used by t…: I guess what especially turns my stomach here is that the idea wasn’t just to inflict mental [...]

By: Dom

Dom — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 19:49:57 +0000

Yes, it was done to prevent further crimes. And it was successful. This is from the IG report that started this post. The redacting was done by the Obama administration:
——————–
With respect to al Nashiri [redacted] reported two waterboard sessions in November 2002, after which the psychologist/interrogations determined that al Nashiri was compliant. However, after being moved [redacted] al Nashiri was thought to be withholding information. Al Nashiri subsequently received additional EITs, [redacted] but not the waterboard. The Agency then determined al Nashiri to be “compliant.” Because of the litany of technique used by different interrogators over a relatively short period of time, it is difficult to identify why exactly al Nashiri became more willing to provide information. However, following the use of EITs, he provided information about his most current operational planning and [redacted] as opposed to the historical information he provided before the use of EITs.
—————————
I have not read the full report, but so far I have not seen a primary reference indicating that waterboarding was done only to provide a link between Iraq and Al-Qaeda.

Why did you put “monsters” in scare quotes like that? You understand that he was a mass-murderer, right?

By: Claude

Claude — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:41:35 +0000

Dom, are you really certain that “preventing further horrific crimes of this nature was the only reason for his interrogation” ? (*cough* torture *cough*) It’s been pretty well-documented that a lot of the waterboarding was done to try and get the prisoners (sorry, “monsters”) to confess to a link between al-Q and Iraq, where none in fact existed. Are you equally comfortable with torture in that situation? And if not, why not?

By: james woodyatt

james woodyatt — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 16:28:34 +0000

Southpaw: It’s not that I don’t understand the impulse to dash his little ones against the rocks; we all do.

I don’t. I simply don’t. Speak for your own damned self.

By: Dom

Dom — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 13:49:36 +0000

Who in this story is “going crazy” or seeking revenge? Not the CIA officials. They are extracting information from someone who probably knows of other plots of mass murder.

Perhaps no one here has digested the extent of this monster’s crime. Here is some perspective. Milosovic ordered the murder of 14 people in a certain villiage. This is listed as one of his “crimes against humanity”. I’m sure no one here would argue that point. Abd al-Nashiri ordered the murder of 17 people and he belongs to an organization that in later years would kill almost 3000 people. Preventing further horrific crimes of this nature was the only reason for his interrogation.

By: Who We Are or Think We Are « Just Above Sunset

Who We Are or Think We Are « Just Above Sunset — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 06:12:20 +0000

[...] That very American, or it isn’t. After hearing that a CIA interrogator threatened to kill the children of a detainee, at least Julian Sanchez feels shame: [...]

By: Consumatopia

Consumatopia — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 02:03:15 +0000

Yeah, if something horrible is done to you or those you love, it’s natural to want to just go crazy on the guy who did it. But your friends are the ones who are holding you back, not the ones egging you on.

By: jre

jre — Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:36:39 +0000

Ah, the frothy topping of self-righteousness over a savory bed of sadism. There’s nothing that smells quite like it.

By: Dom

Dom — Tue, 25 Aug 2009 20:07:02 +0000

“We now have the shameless end of the spectrum pretty well defined.”

I’m pretty sure that was already defined by Abd al-Nashiri’s mass-murder.

By: jre

jre — Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:41:14 +0000

Threatening to kill his kids, which he considers a blessing anyway, is not “horrific”, it is a mild threat.

We now have the shameless end of the spectrum pretty well defined.