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	<title>Comments on: Is Our Children Learning?</title>
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	<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/</link>
	<description>Just another geek in the geek kingdom</description>
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		<title>By: Gordon Lightfoot</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2908</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordon Lightfoot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 19:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2908</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been trying to sort out what I think the potential implications of the use of the word poor are, and I&#039;m in a muddle, because I&#039;m not sure I can easily demonstrate that my intuitions about the word actually touch on anything significant.  If you think that poor is a perfectly useful value neutral word, then there is no reason to deploy &quot;underprivileged&quot;.  But if you think poor isn&#039;t value neutral, even when it is nominally used to describe a person of low income, then you will be tempted to reach for a less suggestive label.  By using &quot;underprivileged,&quot; a person is tacitly admitting that he is uncomfortable using the term poor in a particular context.  It isn&#039;t surprising that children are more frequently described as underprivileged than adults, since they are not considered responsible for their economic conditions.

My feelings on the matter are complicated because I self identify with the term poor.  There is an attitude of solidarity that some of us attach to that term, but not everyone who is nominally poor actually does.  I could say I am comfortable with certain cultural features of the lower class, and that comfort wouldn&#039;t disappear if I were to win the lottery tomorrow.  I think when some really strapped people insist that they aren&#039;t poor, they are saying that they don&#039;t want to be associated with a particular set of social habits and attitudes.  It seems like that&#039;s a distinction that the general use of the word poor misses, and that the development of another label would be useful.  Underresourced doesn&#039;t quite cut it, but it&#039;s a step in that direction. Mind you, I know the English language has enough words already.  But there is an ecology of assumptions riding on the use of that one four letter word, and I am skeptical that this is always clearly understood.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been trying to sort out what I think the potential implications of the use of the word poor are, and I&#8217;m in a muddle, because I&#8217;m not sure I can easily demonstrate that my intuitions about the word actually touch on anything significant.  If you think that poor is a perfectly useful value neutral word, then there is no reason to deploy &#8220;underprivileged&#8221;.  But if you think poor isn&#8217;t value neutral, even when it is nominally used to describe a person of low income, then you will be tempted to reach for a less suggestive label.  By using &#8220;underprivileged,&#8221; a person is tacitly admitting that he is uncomfortable using the term poor in a particular context.  It isn&#8217;t surprising that children are more frequently described as underprivileged than adults, since they are not considered responsible for their economic conditions.</p>
<p>My feelings on the matter are complicated because I self identify with the term poor.  There is an attitude of solidarity that some of us attach to that term, but not everyone who is nominally poor actually does.  I could say I am comfortable with certain cultural features of the lower class, and that comfort wouldn&#8217;t disappear if I were to win the lottery tomorrow.  I think when some really strapped people insist that they aren&#8217;t poor, they are saying that they don&#8217;t want to be associated with a particular set of social habits and attitudes.  It seems like that&#8217;s a distinction that the general use of the word poor misses, and that the development of another label would be useful.  Underresourced doesn&#8217;t quite cut it, but it&#8217;s a step in that direction. Mind you, I know the English language has enough words already.  But there is an ecology of assumptions riding on the use of that one four letter word, and I am skeptical that this is always clearly understood.</p>
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		<title>By: Julian Sanchez</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2907</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian Sanchez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 16:49:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2907</guid>
		<description>I think &quot;poor&quot; is sufficiently neutral in most cases, though I suppose there&#039;s a problem of potential ambiguity in the context of education with constructions like &quot;poor students.&quot;  Also, though this isn&#039;t really an issue when one is talking about children, it&#039;s certainly possible for an adult to be affluent but not &quot;privileged,&quot; or conversely to fall into poverty despite having enjoyed many privileges.   Typically you do see the term used in reference to children, but it would sacrifice an important distinction if &quot;privileged&quot; &amp; &quot;underprivileged&quot; came to be used as synonyms for &quot;rich&quot; &amp; &quot;poor&quot; more generally.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think &#8220;poor&#8221; is sufficiently neutral in most cases, though I suppose there&#8217;s a problem of potential ambiguity in the context of education with constructions like &#8220;poor students.&#8221;  Also, though this isn&#8217;t really an issue when one is talking about children, it&#8217;s certainly possible for an adult to be affluent but not &#8220;privileged,&#8221; or conversely to fall into poverty despite having enjoyed many privileges.   Typically you do see the term used in reference to children, but it would sacrifice an important distinction if &#8220;privileged&#8221; &#038; &#8220;underprivileged&#8221; came to be used as synonyms for &#8220;rich&#8221; &#038; &#8220;poor&#8221; more generally.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordon Lightfoot</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2906</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordon Lightfoot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 15:54:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2906</guid>
		<description>Synonyms for poor:

bad off*, bankrupt, beggared, beggarly, broke*, destitute, dirt poor*, down-and-out*, empty-handed*, flat*, flat broke*, fortuneless, hard up*, impecunious, impoverished, in need, in rags, in want, indigent, insolvent, low, meager, moneyless, necessitous, needy, pauperized, penniless, penurious, pinched*, played out, poverty-stricken, reduced*, scanty*, stone broke*, strapped*, suffering, tapped, truly needy, unprosperous.

You know, of all these terms, poor is probably the least offensive.  Well, impecunious and penurious seem harmless enough.  There is an impulse to find a PC term for poor, since poor carries with it a number of negative associations unrelated to one&#039;s financial situation.  It seems like the problem isn&#039;t really with the word, but with certain cultural assumptions the user might have.  So you could maybe start floating &quot;impecunious&quot; around, but it wouldn&#039;t be long before impecunious carried the same baggage poor does.  The thing with underprivileged, Mr. Sanchez&#039;s criticism notwithstanding, is that it&#039;s an obvious PC word-it&#039;s clearly intended to be a positive term to describe a person without a lot of money-when a person says it, it&#039;s like hearing them say: you are poor, but poor in that unfortunate sense, not poor in that too lazy to keep a job longer than two weeks sense.

So, anyway, I guess I&#039;m for underprivileged even if the etymology of the word is off.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Synonyms for poor:</p>
<p>bad off*, bankrupt, beggared, beggarly, broke*, destitute, dirt poor*, down-and-out*, empty-handed*, flat*, flat broke*, fortuneless, hard up*, impecunious, impoverished, in need, in rags, in want, indigent, insolvent, low, meager, moneyless, necessitous, needy, pauperized, penniless, penurious, pinched*, played out, poverty-stricken, reduced*, scanty*, stone broke*, strapped*, suffering, tapped, truly needy, unprosperous.</p>
<p>You know, of all these terms, poor is probably the least offensive.  Well, impecunious and penurious seem harmless enough.  There is an impulse to find a PC term for poor, since poor carries with it a number of negative associations unrelated to one&#8217;s financial situation.  It seems like the problem isn&#8217;t really with the word, but with certain cultural assumptions the user might have.  So you could maybe start floating &#8220;impecunious&#8221; around, but it wouldn&#8217;t be long before impecunious carried the same baggage poor does.  The thing with underprivileged, Mr. Sanchez&#8217;s criticism notwithstanding, is that it&#8217;s an obvious PC word-it&#8217;s clearly intended to be a positive term to describe a person without a lot of money-when a person says it, it&#8217;s like hearing them say: you are poor, but poor in that unfortunate sense, not poor in that too lazy to keep a job longer than two weeks sense.</p>
<p>So, anyway, I guess I&#8217;m for underprivileged even if the etymology of the word is off.</p>
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		<title>By: Julian Sanchez</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2905</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian Sanchez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 15:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2905</guid>
		<description>&quot;Underresourced&quot; is just not a word.  Would a school with adequate funds, equipment, and personnel be &quot;resourced&quot;?  I wouldn&#039;t normally pick on this kind of thing, but it did jump out at me in a promo for an education program.

Underprivileged makes no sense because a &quot;privilege&quot; is a special favor or advantage.  It is, by definition,  not the sort of thing everyone is supposed to have. You can wish to live in a society where nobody is poor, but it&#039;s just incoherent to wish for a society in which &quot;everybody is privileged,&quot; though the &quot;under&quot; implies that this would be desirable.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Underresourced&#8221; is just not a word.  Would a school with adequate funds, equipment, and personnel be &#8220;resourced&#8221;?  I wouldn&#8217;t normally pick on this kind of thing, but it did jump out at me in a promo for an education program.</p>
<p>Underprivileged makes no sense because a &#8220;privilege&#8221; is a special favor or advantage.  It is, by definition,  not the sort of thing everyone is supposed to have. You can wish to live in a society where nobody is poor, but it&#8217;s just incoherent to wish for a society in which &#8220;everybody is privileged,&#8221; though the &#8220;under&#8221; implies that this would be desirable.</p>
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		<title>By: AemJeff</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2904</link>
		<dc:creator>AemJeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 15:00:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2904</guid>
		<description>A related thought.

&quot;Privilege,&quot; is often used, conversely, as a euphemism for &quot;personal access to capital.&quot;  Do you see a similar problem with that usage?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A related thought.</p>
<p>&#8220;Privilege,&#8221; is often used, conversely, as a euphemism for &#8220;personal access to capital.&#8221;  Do you see a similar problem with that usage?</p>
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		<title>By: AemJeff</title>
		<link>http://www.juliansanchez.com/2007/08/07/is-our-children-learning/comment-page-1/#comment-2903</link>
		<dc:creator>AemJeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Aug 2007 14:47:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://juliansanchez.com/?p=1964#comment-2903</guid>
		<description>Aren&#039;t you nitpicking a couple of pretty innocuous euphemisms?  Isn&#039;t there at least some truth in both of them?  &quot;Underprivileged&quot; might be more metaphorically true, but &quot;underresourced,&quot; particularly if less tangible attributes like quality are included in the calculus, seems like the literal truth.  I don&#039;t see how either term is either untrue, or even particularly misleading.  Where&#039;s the harm?
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aren&#8217;t you nitpicking a couple of pretty innocuous euphemisms?  Isn&#8217;t there at least some truth in both of them?  &#8220;Underprivileged&#8221; might be more metaphorically true, but &#8220;underresourced,&#8221; particularly if less tangible attributes like quality are included in the calculus, seems like the literal truth.  I don&#8217;t see how either term is either untrue, or even particularly misleading.  Where&#8217;s the harm?</p>
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